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889
- ↓ 4.00
- ꩜ 6.31
- ↑ 95.86
{@} → Crash Chant : 20×
Choose up to 4 in any combination of Pokémon Tool cards and Technical Machine cards in play (both yours and your opponent’s) and discard them. This attack does 20 damage times the number of cards discarded in this way.
{P}{C} → Horror Chant : 40
If your opponent has 4 or more Benched Pokémon, choose 1 of them and return that Pokémon and all cards attached to it to your opponent’s hand.
illus. Midori Harada · LV.33
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feyblade
This card is beautifully designed: both of these effects hinge around the number “4.” In Japanese, “4” and “death” are pronounced very similarly…
Adam Capriola
The more you know!
Blob Takeshi
Oh shi….t.
Warnock 2022
Very interesting! I imagine that’s why Hisuian Typhlosion 𝙑𝙎𝙏𝘼𝙍 (which is ghost-type) can OHKO an opponent with exactly four damage counters on it…
Foon-Gus Fring
Trying to find another attack similar to “Crash Chant,” but I can’t find any! Closest seems to be Rotom 𝙑 and 𝙑𝙎𝙏𝘼𝙍…
Warnock 2022
“Horror Chant” resembles attacks like “Spin Storm” or “Spit Squall.”
televisionnation
If I attach Expert Belt to Mismagius & then discard it as part of Crash Chant do I still get the +20 bonus from the tool? Or is it discarded before the effect applies?
JP
This is an interesting question and worth thinking through; this situation isn’t covered in the Compendium LV.X ( https://compendium.pokegym.net/compendium-lvx.html ) & I couldn’t find any analogous example in there either.
We can refer to the Arceus rulebook ( https://www.judgeball.com/files/archives/tcg-rulebooks/en/PL4.pdf ) page 18 & 19. These pages cover attack sequencing and damage calculation. Page 18 step (c) says ‘If necessary, do anything the attack requires you to do in order to use it. (For example, Rattata’s Lunge reads, “Flip a coin. If tails, this attack does nothing.” So, flip a coin now.).’ And then (f) reads “Do whatever the attack says. Do any damage first, then do any other effects, and finally, Knock Out any Pokémon that have damage greater than or equal to their Hit Points.” So you could argue it two ways:
1) Since the damage dealt depends on how many Tools you discard, the discard effect is something that “the attack requires you to do in order to use it.” In this case the discard happens before damage is dealt and Belt damage wouldn’t be added.
2) The discard effect is an “other effect.” In this case, per (f) damage is dealt first, and Belt damage is added.
There is also page 19, which has the last step (h) of damage calculation as “Now that damage has been done, if the attack does anything other than damage, do all of that.” This would also support Belt damage being added (again if you consider discarding to be “anything other than damage”).
Finally, while this isn’t a DP era ruling, there is a Compendium ruling in the SM era for Blacephalon-GX and Beast Energy (https://compendium.pokegym.net/category/3-attacks/mind-blown/). This ruling says that Beast Energy’s +30 damage still happens even if it is chosen to be Lost Zoned.
Based on all this, it seems that Expert Belt damage would be added for Crash Chant. The sequence is: choose the Tools to be discarded, deal the damage, then actually do the discards.
Ambassador
Would you consider Expert Belt to be different in any way from Strength Charm for the purpose of this question? There’s a pokemon-card.com Q&A that asks fundamentally the same question but swaps the Tool out to Strength Charm, and the answer there is that no, the extra damage isn’t applied.
JP
Update on this: this actually is in Compendium LV.X ( https://compendium.pokegym.net/compendium-lvx.html ). No idea how I missed it; that would’ve saved a lot of time:
Q. If I have “Expert Belt” attached to Mismagius and discard it using its “Crash Chant” attack, does it deal 40 or 20 damage?
A. It only does 20 damage. Crash Chant’s attack text specifies that you discard the Tools/TMs as soon as they are chosen and then calculate the attacks damage based on the number of Tools/TMs discarded. By the step where you modify that damage for the effect of Expert Belt, it is no longer attached to Mismagius. (Nov 5, 2009 PUI Rules Team)
(But all the stuff I wrote previously is still true… including the Blacephalon-GX ruling where it’s ruled “the other way!”)
Ambassador
As far as Blacephalon GX goes, there’s a Q&A on pokemon-card.com that’s identical to that ruling, sans any elaboration on why it’s the case. As I think you’re implying here by putting “the other way” in quotations, the Blacephalon GX ruling is the default way these damage calculations would be handled, and Mismagius is different only because of the particular way Crash Chant is translated (specifying the damage done is to be calculated after the tools are discarded. The same phrasing can be found on the original JP print).